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I created the open-source language Vale [0] and this hits home for me

I created the open-source language Vale [0] and this hits home for me. This is one of the bigger reasons I ended my career at Google. I created Vale just before coming to Google, almost a decade ago. For _years_ I repeatedly wondered whether I should hand it over to Google via go/opensourcing. It would mean I could work on it for 20% time, and maybe eventually full-time, which would have been my dream. Every time, I came to the same decision: Google cannot be trusted with ownership of Vale. Three reasons: 1. I wouldn't be able to refuse if they told me to add tracking, analytics, AI "learning", or lock-in mechanisms. 2. If at any point they thought that Vale competed with Golang, they would shut it down. It doesn't matter that they're completely different (Vale doesn't even have a GC); if any person in the chain of command even had the _perception_ that it did, Vale would die. 3. If at any point they wanted the headcount for other things, they would shut it down. This happened to my first team (MyMaps) and second team (Earth) and hundreds of other teams across Google. …

Original discussionStop Building on Corporate-Controlled Languages313 source comments · at import
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CO

Question about Vale's positioning, where does it exist relative to Zig and Nim? At a brief glance Vale seems closed to C than C++, which seems to put it in some of the same use cases as Zig, but perhaps a bit higher level. Is that an accurate assessment?

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SK

Good for you, but I don't quite get the reasoning. I wouldn't expect any guarantee that Google will fund work on an experimental open source project indefinitely, or to pay for work they no longer care about. But why not accept funding on a temporary basis? When they get bored with the experiment and funding dries up, or they want to go in a direction you don't like, the source is out there and you could keep going on your own.

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SP

I work for Google now on an open source project, and have worked on open source language projects for them before. This is just not how things happen. At all. There's a lot of fear in our post about things that _could_ happen, but haven't actually happened in Google's history, or aren't unique to corporate sponsorship. > 1. I wouldn't be able to refuse if they told me to add tracking, analytics, AI "learning", or lock-in mechanisms. Google just doesn't do this with OSS projects. I've never seen on mine, or heard about it in others, or heard news of problems. I did work near a CLI that sent some usage analytics back (so they could see crash reports, etc) and some people complained, and it was removed. It was never nefarious and the idea that Google is trying to make better ad profiles or somesuch via OSS projects is frankly ludicrous. > 2. If at any point they thought that Vale competed w…

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NA

I find myself only replying to people who disagree with me. That is sad. I've added Vale to my blog post. It looks very interesting. Congratulations on taking a stand for what you believe in.

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MF

First time I've seriously looked at Vale. Looks pretty great. One thing that I didn't see in the guide, probably toward the end (maybe in "Patterns") is some discussion about error handling.

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